Ok. This is terrifying but - with the news of Facebook censoring AU news* (whether or not you want to blame the AU government - FB made the call) - I’m considering quitting Facebook!
As you can imagine, this is basically instant death for a writer. But, I think I want to do it and move here, make Substack my home. I am sick of Mark Fucking Zuckerberg benefiting from my work. And I’m exhausted by the constant abuse, the relentless trolling, and just the shitty way people casually engage on there.
I love the people who I chat to on my Facebook page - but after seven years of Facebook financially benefiting from my work (and people abusing me - they benefit from that too), I feel like maybe it’s my time. I had a moment today after I read the news where I thought - Fuck it. I am quitting everything. But then I thought - Why should I? Zuk has killed so many creatives, I don’t want him to smash me into the ground too. I have always wanted to be a writer full-time and back myself. Maybe this is my chance to give it a real go? And do that ethically?
So I need your advice. Should I do it? Should I take the plunge, quit FB and just hope people sign up here? I would post here instead of Facebook. Share stuff here instead of Facebook.
Should I just follow my heart and make Substack my community? I would love to hear from you - you’re the folks who have stuck with me and supported me. I trust your judgement. Let me know what you think x Em x
*This directly impacts me even though I’m not a “journalist” as my writing is hosted on The Spinoff. But also, I hate seeing hardworking journalists being fucked by a billionaire who has no values. I want to ethically do the right thing.
I hope that you are going to be part of the pioneers that can bring this change about. Stepping out of the uncomfortable but familiar space into a huge unknown is scary. I work in the Digital Marketing space and wanted to (over)share some thoughts to help you as you process this. 1. Yay for substack and spinoff and other news platforms that currently host your content and will host your content in the future. 2. Walking away from the big FB means no longer having an epicly huge audience, they are one of the few companies out there who have reached true market saturation. 3. Trolls live in the dark corners of the internet and should be stopped!
So if you were coming to me for a strategy on what to do next here is where I would want to begin. (these numbers relate to the 3 earlier ones)
1. You have great platforms that you are on, what is your targeted plan to grow the number of platforms you are on or the audience within that platform. (You know, so you can pay bills?)
2. FBK size. Big audiences aren't everything. The right audience is. So invest time and find expertise that will help you to reach that audience effectively. (YIP, keywords and SEO!). Because of its wealth of data FBK and its platforms can tailor to your every need, stepping away from them gives you independence from paying MZ but prepare now to have to do some of this leg work yourself to be hugely successful (I do believe you can do this!)
3. I actually believe that you have the ability to force change in the face of Trolls but it will take a genius plan. Some haters will follow you around, if you make noise on any platform (and you should be making noise as you discuss important things) haters will step up. Weave into your strategy not only how you plan to shut down individual trolls but also your vision of a world where its culturally unacceptable to shame people like trolls do. Peer pressure is a powerful thing and with your audience and platform I love the idea of you using peer pressure to push back the dark things trolls say.
You are talking about an EPIC change of strategy as an influencer so now is probably a good time to find additional mentor support in this area. Perhaps someone volunteering through your blog (no creeps though) or something like Icehouse near you?
Technically you asked for advice so I hope I am not overstepping a boundary with this essay. I am just one person with an opinion so feel free to cherry pick which, if any, parts of this help you move forward in your decision making.
You're not overstepping! This is hugely, hugely helpful and I'm so very grateful to you for sharing it with me! Honestly, it helps me heaps and it is very generous of you!
This made me think also that you can do public posts on Substack where everyone can like and read the comments but only paying subscribers (or at least logged in subscribers) can actually write comments. This is what Heather Cox Richardson has in place.
Think this is awesome feedback and echo the suggestion of business mentorship. I found it very helpful when starting my own business and there are some savvy people out there who have done it all before and can help guide you.
The only piece i saw as missing before with substack was missing the discussion element, but had not really explored it. I want to be able to say easily that I love a piece, or that it resonated, without feeling like a weirdo having to send as an email :-)
Kia ora Emily. Nothing will change if we don't. Your inner compas informs everything you write and is a major reason you have built such a trusting and supportive network. That inner compass is telling you to leave. Give your network the chance to support your transition, I think you will be surprised by the number of subscriptions that will follow such a brave move. Give them all the information and justifications and be upfront about your needs regarding financial and resource support. Those who can't support financially may be able to in other ways (marketing, sharing threads and emails). It will be 'instant death' of the FB Emily but you are much more than that and I believe you can build platform/s that won't eat away at your sense of self. Zuk will continue making unethical power plays. It is the natural outcome of maintaining the unnatural monopoly of his beyond toxic platform. It won't be easy, of course, but imagine how incredible the outcome could be! You are a creator, a builder. You can do it chick. x
Thank you! You've made me cry - I really feel like this is it eh? It's time to walk the talk and be braver and honestly - you're all so wonderfully kind and generous.
I reckon giving fb the flick would be a great idea. For all the reasons you mention. I mean, fuck fb. They have an almost complete monopoly on all creative/worthy/intelligent discourse. Let them keep the stuff and nonsense . I almost guarantee if you move platforms, others will follow in droves (both readers and writers).
I’ve personally stopped engaging with Facebook because it’s too toxic - I engage with your writing via here/your newsletters the the Spinoff app! Do you know whether Substack have a more mobile-friendly webpage/app to engage on? Could just make it easier for people to access.
Equally - from a purely logical commercial perspective, I would trial the pull away from Facebook and see how it impacts your income. Sometimes you’ve got to deal with the monsters to survive, and I wouldn’t want to see your writing reaching a smaller audience just because Facebook are evil - your words need to be heard!
Just subscribed as I love the idea of removing control from FB. Your writing is like a breath of fresh air to me living here now in the states. I wish you luck with whatever you decide!!
Hi Emily. I found you via spinoff- have never seen you on fb. I am also ready to quit fb. The only thing holding me back is that I come from a huge family and it connects me to my cousins - however, think I need to remind myself that resourceful people will find other ways. We have come to believe that we are ‘chained’ to fb in the same kind of way I was once chained to smoking- I quit that and only good things happened :)
Hi Frances, I had the same concerns. However having deleted FB, I've found that the people I want to keep in touch with I still am through separate means, and having everyone else drop off the radar has given me space to invest more time and mental energy into a smaller number of people and enhance those relationships.
I’ve followed you on FB for a long time and wondered where you find the strength to stand up to trolls. Personally I find FB comment threads a toxic sludge to be avoided at all costs and the odd time I weigh in, even in private groups, often end in literal tears. In fact, just last night I made the mistake of looking at a Stuff FB comment thread on Sia’s shitty ableist movie. Now I feel like crap having seen what NZers think of Autistic opinions on the way we’re portrayed (and if I read, “what about Rain Man?”, one more time I’ll scream). Frankly it would be fabulous to be able to read your posts, as well as the comments, in a relatively safe space so that I don’t have to brace for Steve’s misogynistic two cents. As others have said though, you will need a good marketing plan and, as a marketer myself, I’ve gotta say FB/Insta are tough to ignore. But maybe your strategy could look to utilise other pages through partnerships to maintain your personal brand in those channels. Then you’re removed from the emotionally exhausting task of page admin. Whatever you choose, take care of yourself.
Kia ora Emily. I've never been on Fakebook, and if you made your content available elsewhere, I would be able to consider subscribing. Okay, I could do so now, but I only found out about this post through someone else who follows you on Fakebook. So yeah, I am all in favour. And you have the content to go bold, and make a difference to your life and the lives of your followers, or at least send a strong message.
You could also still post pointers to your content to Facebook, along with a sentence on why you're asking people to follow you elsewhere, and use your social capital to help others see the light. Fakebook is as evil as can be, and the more we can avoid Fakebook, Instagram, and Whatsapp, the better for our own sake, health, and sanity.
FYI, and shameless self-plug! Save the date if you want: on 26 March at 10:00 am NZ time, I'll be presenting at the EHF Springboard sessions on Slavery 2.0, i.e. how BigTech companies like Fakebook farm little models of you and your behavioural patterns, subject these machine learning models to rigorous testing that'd be illegal in the world (akin to pharma tests being done on prisoners against their will, except much more rigorous) with the sole goal to better monopolise your attention, because then they can sell you for more. Watch this space, it's about to be announced any day now: https://www.ehf.org/live-sessions
I like how substack sends me an email with the actual reply or reaction, where other platforms just tell me that someone updated a thread. This way, I can decide right there whether I need to open the thread in the browser, or just be done with it. So here's a +1 for substack. Fakebook would never do this, for it'd mean less ad revenue for Mark Fucking Zuckerberg.
I don't read you on FB, only through the emails you send out or Spinoff. FB wastes so much time. I wish my local community groups would stop using it as their main way of getting information out there.
Thank you Angela - I'll check out the article. But I would definitely, definitely do mostly free content so nobody missed out. I know things are so hard right now (for me too!) x
There are various tip jar like solutions out there, which would allow people to toss a few dollars your way.
Also, you might want to have a look at https://www.planetary.social/, which actually builds on a technology developed in Wellington! This is a decentralised social network, i.e. there are no gatekeepers anymore, and one of the core missions of Planetary was to make it easy for people to pay for content they like. Might be too early in its development though.
Thank you Martin! I think Substack for now is the best place to do donations - as I like that I'm giving something in exchange <3 Planetary sounds fascinating though!
I shut down my FB last year and haven't been back. I follow you on Insta (which often seems like a kindER (not kind!) space?) and get your emails/find your stuff on The Spinoff. I agree with some other comments - try it and if it doesn't work, go back to FB but think about how you can make it easier/better for you??
I absolutely support this in principle but what about your event promotion? How will that work without Facebook? You'd be dependent on the venue or promoter to create the listing and raise awareness etc. I know that Facebook dominates the events-listing space these days. (Sigh.)
For what it's worth, Emily, I haven't seen one of your fb posts in the longest time. I subscribed to your writing via Spinoff, I think, and get the emails in the inbox. This is clearly an ethical issue and I fully support that. Obviously it's a scary decision because of the threatening sword of financial doom that likes to swing its blade over our heads. What happened when you made your last subscription appeal? Did it have the effect that you wanted? Were you tightening your belt or breaking even? If you had to tighten your belt for a while, what effect would that have on your family? Will the fear of the potential consequences keep you awake or will you sleep better at night having cut ties to a draining and unethical company? I don't understand how the money works with fb or with subscriptions, so I don't feel in any position to tell you what to do, but I'm sure that there are more people out there who would be happy to chip in a bit for content they enjoy - they just need to know it's an option.
Thank you! I basically make no money from FB unless it's indirectly (people following me from there to here or buying tickets to the play). My husband said a similar thing that you did - that cutting ties with a company I think is totally immoral will help me sleep better and feel less stressed. I have really felt the love in this post - it makes me feel like I can do it.
Emily, I understand exactly where you are coming from. I run a small business that is so reliant on social media, and I’m involved in running a number of events that also rely on FB. Having said that, I stopped using my personal FB account 18 months ago, including FB messaging. That was a hard decision because my personal profile was linked quite tightly with my business; but it was absolutely draining and took up too much time and caused too much anxiety, with people ignoring boundaries. I’ll have to decide what to do in terms of my business pages.
Having said that, what is the emotional cost for you to have to deal with the trolls? I can’t see FB stepping up any time soon. And censoring Australian news so that Police, Health, and other pages can’t be seen in the middle of a pandemic is utterly disgusting.
And also what is your audience demographic? I’ve found younger people are moving away from FB. I find a more conservative audience at FB, whereas I found the Spinoff, when I was doing a search on a couple of subjects of interest on Google - and the Spinoff is wonderful and full of writing that gets me thinking.
What Mairi said was spot on - do you need a large audience or the right audience? SEO and keyword search can work very well and I’ve had a couple of mentors point me in the right direction.
Weirdly enough I actually joined Twitter when I had said I never would. I think I joined initially for Sam Neill and Siouxsie Wiles. Siouxsie, being a woman in science, gets a lot of horrible trolling though. I ignore most of the trash on Twitter but I do get great recommendations on writers to follow.
Your writing is wonderful, whatever happens I’m here to stay, and I’ll be telling other people about your writing. Judging by other comments about how readers discovered you it seems that word of mouth works well for you, too.
Thanks so much Kat. I definitely want the right audience, not a big audience. In fact - the 'big' part of it is what I find most overwheming. There's a huge emotional cost to dealing with trolls and I've had six years of it. I just don't think I can cope with it anymore. My hope is that I can move here and folks will follow and share x Thanks for your support x
Oh this is such a hard one! I totally get why you want to drop the mic and ditch them. BUT..... You will reach so few people without FB relatively speaking and and will essentially be preaching to the converted and not changing mindsets and shifting the dial which you do so well and maybe don’t even realise it!
Yeah it's definitely a hard one. I think there's still a way to do that - by other people sharing my content, without me having to be so involved. I never wanted to be someone who argues online with people or changes minds. And I guess I don't think of what I do as preaching (I know that's just a saying but you know what I mean). Most days I just want to share stuff - and it turns into people arguing with me about the most inane stuff and I'm just like, not trying to have a debate! I'm just sharing stuff! So I think of it as saying - after six years, I just don't have the energy for people always wanting to fight me on the most basic stuff.
Fair enough! I confess to forgetting momentarily that you’re are not marketing product, rather, a human being! When I was young I wanted to work in social policy thinking that’s where i could make the biggest change. Then I wanted to be a child or educational psychologist. Then I saw how effective you could be with just a pen (ok, keyboard) and a platform like FB and I think it’s amazing what you have achieved.
Here’s my rudimentary take on things and your role in it: Nathan Wallis sets the scene with the science stuff. Penny Brownlee captures young mummas who know in their gut that their blueprint is off and they need to reboot. You catch us at unexpected moments for years after, keeping things real, reminding us as only you can to stay fierce and kind and parent with empathy and treat children with respect. Whatever you choose I’ll still be there as will the others reading this right now and maybe that’s enough!
I completely understand where you're coming from but I think the problem is that you would get a lot of new subscribers via Facebook. It's probably good publicity. Can you turn off comments on FB posts to avoid trolls (and I guess incentivize people to subscribe so they can comment?
Yeah it would be ideal if I could turn off comments and just direct people here but unfortunately I can't! It's always shitted me because comments get out of control and I spend my life moderating.
I will support you 100% no matter what you do, but I think you should go for it and leave FB in the dust. I, too, am sick of the dominance that these companies have and how they have tried to infiltrate every area of the way we communicate with one another as human beings - and then hold us to ransom if we try to get rid of them. It ain't right!
I am a paid subscriber and I will gladly pay for your content no matter what. You are an important voice and I appreciate all you do xo
I really, really like Substack and I really dislike Fb. You follow your heart. I'm with Karen Phillips - Fb is s time sink and there are way better ways for communities to build communications without all the noise on Zuckerberg's wire
Hi Emily I I found you on Facebook and I love your writing.
I hate Zuka as much as the next person but I find myself using Facebook a LOT these days to keep in touch with neighbourly stuff. Now I'm a stay at home mum it's a great lifeline.
What will the alternative be to not using facebook may I ask?
Everyone seems to be switching to Insta. I don't have an Insta account and don't want one. It's all the same evil....
The alternative would be this platform - sending out what I would usually put on FB here. Having chats and discussions here... It's great because you don't get trolls here.
I find Instagram better because if I comment on Facebook then that post pops into the feed of my friends and family but Insta is more... anonymous. That's not quite the right word but I find it's much easier to curate my feed there.
I'm torn. It feels like they're trying to get you to quit. If someone tells me I can't do something , my immediate reaction is "oh really, watch me". I would stay just to piss them off. But don't put anything out there that they can profit from... I will always read your writing. The lady couple of years have been extremely difficult for me, and sometimes your articles are the only thing that made me laugh. So no matter your decision, I will continue to try to support you & your hard work!
Um, what's substack? I found you on the spinoff and follow you via subscription email and have never seen a FB post. I also agree you can write anything from Mars and I'll still read it - you're the best! Keep on being you and good luck working out what to do.
This is Substack - the platform I use to send out the newsletter and what we're having this discussion on. You're so kind x I really appreciate you and everyone else's enormous generosity!
Why not run the experiment? Surely you can always go back if it doesn’t work?I’m in Aus and it’s hard to continue to support the ridiculous Zuckerberg influence-shame was I was in some super cool social justice groups on Facebook that I’d really miss if I gave it up (though we mostly commented on news so maybe we are dissolved already). I’m new to sub-stack, and thought I subscribed ages ago but haven’t checked regular money is coming out of my account so is there a way to find that out? Or maybe I paid a yearly subscription? Sorry, sleep deprived and crap with admin like this. Can you help us newbies with any how to guides! Like others, I will follow you wherever you may go...keep doing you Emily, it’s horrible hearing the impact that those trolls can have on you so any way you can do your thang safer gets my vote. 🙌
Hey Rose - you should be getting weekly emails if you're a paid subscriber? Go to substack.com and check your account details. It could be that the newsletter is going to spam? I can definitely do a how-to guide! Thank you so much x
Sooo worth it-I’m getting the weekly emails-and just checked that I’m all paid up! I congratulate my past self for such excellent judgement. Thanks again for all that you do Emily-it is so appreciated 🙌
To be honest, I never knew you had a Facebook page (I now have fomo for having missed out on so much) so it won't personally make much difference to me. I will, however, miss your stories about ridiculous Facebook groups and their absurd members! I am happy to support and follow you through this platform and Instagram - although are you considering deleting that too since it's owned by Facebook? I feel like people are happy to support initiatives that move away from lining the golden pockets of billionaires as long as it doesn't come at the expense of negatively impacting your livelihood? Will support you either way :)
Hi Emily, I completely understand why you want to leave Facebook. I will read from wherever you are posting. I would hate to miss out on any of your amazing writing!
Personally I'd go wherever you decide to host your writing. Lots of people are using other platforms, and I subscribe to wherever they go :) Love your writing, and would hate to miss out! <3
Totally agree with your decision to leave FB. I found you on the spinoff and love your emails and don't follow you on FB. Heroines make our world keep spinning!! Kia kaha!
I deactivated FB nearly three weeks ago after using it constantly since 2007 - I thought I'd miss it more than I have, although I'll admit that FOMO has made me check in for a few minutes once a week over that time just to make sure. I feel like an ex-smoker! I haven't decided whether I'll delete my account completely yet, I might just keep doing what I'm doing or pare everything back so that it's just a source for events and business information. I prefer reading your posts via email, and I can satisfy my social media jollies via IG (yeah, I know, owned by FB but I find it a less stressful and more inspiring place to hang out) - that's my 2c worth...
I very rarely look at facebook these days. I mostly use instagram and subscriptions to keep up to date with people. I say do it- especially if it's beneficial for your mental health. I guess you could always go back if it didn't work out?
I like getting your posts by email so wouldn’t feel as if I was “missing out” if you weren’t on Facebook. Do what your conscience says, if it becomes too difficult without it you can always go back (but I really hope it is possible without it!). Zuc is such a bell-end and Scott Morrison a twit
absolutely is!! We want Jacinda to make us West NZ and take over from the dumb fuck - he had to get 'Jenny's perspective' (his wifey) on a young staffer raped in Parliament House - WTF?? "Jenny put in into perspective for me - what if it was one of our daughters?' and he is our 'leader',
Follow you on Insta and subscribe to The Spinoff so never look at your page on FB so won't be a loss for me. But understandably a huge leap for you, can you go back to FB if it doesn't work out?
Hi Emily, it's a tough question eh? I run social media for a union, and as you'd imagine Facebook runs contrary to our values. Unfortunately, we have to go where our members are (and Facebook groups are an excellent organising tool), so we are stuck for the moment. At the risk of sounding like an unfeeling robot, perhaps let your metrics make the decision for you? And consider keeping Zuck's face on a nearby dartboard
YES! FB is a nasty nasty hole of misogyny. Have you considered creating an equivalent space in something like Discord (a lot of patreon folks use discord channels to chat with fans). You can control the channels/lists quite well I believe. I stopped using FB over a year ago - the account is still active so i can use Messenger, but i rarely use the main FB anymore.
Substack has a lot of features I don't use. So I think I would just start using them! Thanks so much Lyndon. I definitely agree - I'm so tired of the misogyny there.
I was introduced to you through Gem and Kiki and then read your stuff on Spinoff then subscribed to this. I also follow you on Insta and love that buzz. Facebook can eat shit.
Thank you! I realised I probably should have just said "my substack newsletter" or just "my newsletter" because that explains it better. Thank you so much for signing up!
I just caught up on the Australia/FB news and I am disgusted. 100% support you getting off of there. I kind of hope these kinds of issues start causing people to jump ship from FB in enough numbers that we all come up with other ways to stay connected. Like you are doing. Good on ya. I will be trying to stay off FB for a while after this. Not for the first time, but it's hard as I use it for several homeschooling/parenting groups.
I've got the Gilmore Girls theme song stuck in my head now! I'll add my voice to the chorus: leave Facebook. We will follow. I subscribed to your newsletter the day I read your "parenting is political" piece and realised what was missing from so much of the inane parenting content I read. I don't think it's fair that you or other similar people in the public eye should be copping awful online abuse and trolling - it's like you are paying the price for our "free" content.
Does that mean you'd give IG the flick too? I love your writing, but not via FB, i love your IG stories (watch them daily) and i read your emails sometimes, they are the gold amongst the shit spam in my inbox, when i find see them i read them (note to self; must sort out my spam). Fuck FB.
I hope that you are going to be part of the pioneers that can bring this change about. Stepping out of the uncomfortable but familiar space into a huge unknown is scary. I work in the Digital Marketing space and wanted to (over)share some thoughts to help you as you process this. 1. Yay for substack and spinoff and other news platforms that currently host your content and will host your content in the future. 2. Walking away from the big FB means no longer having an epicly huge audience, they are one of the few companies out there who have reached true market saturation. 3. Trolls live in the dark corners of the internet and should be stopped!
So if you were coming to me for a strategy on what to do next here is where I would want to begin. (these numbers relate to the 3 earlier ones)
1. You have great platforms that you are on, what is your targeted plan to grow the number of platforms you are on or the audience within that platform. (You know, so you can pay bills?)
2. FBK size. Big audiences aren't everything. The right audience is. So invest time and find expertise that will help you to reach that audience effectively. (YIP, keywords and SEO!). Because of its wealth of data FBK and its platforms can tailor to your every need, stepping away from them gives you independence from paying MZ but prepare now to have to do some of this leg work yourself to be hugely successful (I do believe you can do this!)
3. I actually believe that you have the ability to force change in the face of Trolls but it will take a genius plan. Some haters will follow you around, if you make noise on any platform (and you should be making noise as you discuss important things) haters will step up. Weave into your strategy not only how you plan to shut down individual trolls but also your vision of a world where its culturally unacceptable to shame people like trolls do. Peer pressure is a powerful thing and with your audience and platform I love the idea of you using peer pressure to push back the dark things trolls say.
You are talking about an EPIC change of strategy as an influencer so now is probably a good time to find additional mentor support in this area. Perhaps someone volunteering through your blog (no creeps though) or something like Icehouse near you?
Technically you asked for advice so I hope I am not overstepping a boundary with this essay. I am just one person with an opinion so feel free to cherry pick which, if any, parts of this help you move forward in your decision making.
You're not overstepping! This is hugely, hugely helpful and I'm so very grateful to you for sharing it with me! Honestly, it helps me heaps and it is very generous of you!
This made me think also that you can do public posts on Substack where everyone can like and read the comments but only paying subscribers (or at least logged in subscribers) can actually write comments. This is what Heather Cox Richardson has in place.
Yes! Great idea. Thank you!
Think this is awesome feedback and echo the suggestion of business mentorship. I found it very helpful when starting my own business and there are some savvy people out there who have done it all before and can help guide you.
The only piece i saw as missing before with substack was missing the discussion element, but had not really explored it. I want to be able to say easily that I love a piece, or that it resonated, without feeling like a weirdo having to send as an email :-)
Go Emily, do what's right for you :-)
Thank you so much! This is my first 'discussion' thread so I feel like I'll do a lot more of these. x
Kia ora Emily. Nothing will change if we don't. Your inner compas informs everything you write and is a major reason you have built such a trusting and supportive network. That inner compass is telling you to leave. Give your network the chance to support your transition, I think you will be surprised by the number of subscriptions that will follow such a brave move. Give them all the information and justifications and be upfront about your needs regarding financial and resource support. Those who can't support financially may be able to in other ways (marketing, sharing threads and emails). It will be 'instant death' of the FB Emily but you are much more than that and I believe you can build platform/s that won't eat away at your sense of self. Zuk will continue making unethical power plays. It is the natural outcome of maintaining the unnatural monopoly of his beyond toxic platform. It won't be easy, of course, but imagine how incredible the outcome could be! You are a creator, a builder. You can do it chick. x
Thank you! You've made me cry - I really feel like this is it eh? It's time to walk the talk and be braver and honestly - you're all so wonderfully kind and generous.
I reckon giving fb the flick would be a great idea. For all the reasons you mention. I mean, fuck fb. They have an almost complete monopoly on all creative/worthy/intelligent discourse. Let them keep the stuff and nonsense . I almost guarantee if you move platforms, others will follow in droves (both readers and writers).
I totally agree! Thank you for your support x
I’ve personally stopped engaging with Facebook because it’s too toxic - I engage with your writing via here/your newsletters the the Spinoff app! Do you know whether Substack have a more mobile-friendly webpage/app to engage on? Could just make it easier for people to access.
Equally - from a purely logical commercial perspective, I would trial the pull away from Facebook and see how it impacts your income. Sometimes you’ve got to deal with the monsters to survive, and I wouldn’t want to see your writing reaching a smaller audience just because Facebook are evil - your words need to be heard!
Thank you so much. I don't know about the app - I will ask the folks at Substack!
Start a newsletter on Mars if you like, I'll always follow you. Arohanui xox
Oh! You'll make me cry!
me too
Just subscribed as I love the idea of removing control from FB. Your writing is like a breath of fresh air to me living here now in the states. I wish you luck with whatever you decide!!
You're the best Amy. Thank you so much. I'm feeling quite teary at that! x
Hi Emily. I found you via spinoff- have never seen you on fb. I am also ready to quit fb. The only thing holding me back is that I come from a huge family and it connects me to my cousins - however, think I need to remind myself that resourceful people will find other ways. We have come to believe that we are ‘chained’ to fb in the same kind of way I was once chained to smoking- I quit that and only good things happened :)
Hi Frances, I had the same concerns. However having deleted FB, I've found that the people I want to keep in touch with I still am through separate means, and having everyone else drop off the radar has given me space to invest more time and mental energy into a smaller number of people and enhance those relationships.
I’ve followed you on FB for a long time and wondered where you find the strength to stand up to trolls. Personally I find FB comment threads a toxic sludge to be avoided at all costs and the odd time I weigh in, even in private groups, often end in literal tears. In fact, just last night I made the mistake of looking at a Stuff FB comment thread on Sia’s shitty ableist movie. Now I feel like crap having seen what NZers think of Autistic opinions on the way we’re portrayed (and if I read, “what about Rain Man?”, one more time I’ll scream). Frankly it would be fabulous to be able to read your posts, as well as the comments, in a relatively safe space so that I don’t have to brace for Steve’s misogynistic two cents. As others have said though, you will need a good marketing plan and, as a marketer myself, I’ve gotta say FB/Insta are tough to ignore. But maybe your strategy could look to utilise other pages through partnerships to maintain your personal brand in those channels. Then you’re removed from the emotionally exhausting task of page admin. Whatever you choose, take care of yourself.
Thank you Shannon. I'm so with you - and I desperately want to be free of that daily toxicity. And I'm sorry, the ableism on FB is brutal x
Kia ora Emily. I've never been on Fakebook, and if you made your content available elsewhere, I would be able to consider subscribing. Okay, I could do so now, but I only found out about this post through someone else who follows you on Fakebook. So yeah, I am all in favour. And you have the content to go bold, and make a difference to your life and the lives of your followers, or at least send a strong message.
You could also still post pointers to your content to Facebook, along with a sentence on why you're asking people to follow you elsewhere, and use your social capital to help others see the light. Fakebook is as evil as can be, and the more we can avoid Fakebook, Instagram, and Whatsapp, the better for our own sake, health, and sanity.
FYI, and shameless self-plug! Save the date if you want: on 26 March at 10:00 am NZ time, I'll be presenting at the EHF Springboard sessions on Slavery 2.0, i.e. how BigTech companies like Fakebook farm little models of you and your behavioural patterns, subject these machine learning models to rigorous testing that'd be illegal in the world (akin to pharma tests being done on prisoners against their will, except much more rigorous) with the sole goal to better monopolise your attention, because then they can sell you for more. Watch this space, it's about to be announced any day now: https://www.ehf.org/live-sessions
Martin
I just subscribed. Well done. ;)
I like how substack sends me an email with the actual reply or reaction, where other platforms just tell me that someone updated a thread. This way, I can decide right there whether I need to open the thread in the browser, or just be done with it. So here's a +1 for substack. Fakebook would never do this, for it'd mean less ad revenue for Mark Fucking Zuckerberg.
That sounds awesome. I will definitely check it out. Thank you Martin!
The programme is now up: https://www.notion.so/Impact-Springboard-3-22-27th-March-2021-376d66ba85c14bcf84ef82d9ee0a5ab2?showMoveTo=true
I don't read you on FB, only through the emails you send out or Spinoff. FB wastes so much time. I wish my local community groups would stop using it as their main way of getting information out there.
This is my me, too endorsement for you. Well said.
Very happy to keep supporting you here. And also no judgement if you decide to stick it out on Facebook. Or if you change your mind later or anything.
Hi Emily, I love you wherever you are and this is really interesting and inspiring.
Would you only do paid subscriber content by e mail?
Obviously you need to earn a living and many pockets are having to prioritise now due to covid etc.
Here’s another intersection article on this topic..
https://leoniedawson.com/businesses-quit-social-media/
Good luck!!
Thank you Angela - I'll check out the article. But I would definitely, definitely do mostly free content so nobody missed out. I know things are so hard right now (for me too!) x
You are so generous and talented.
There are various tip jar like solutions out there, which would allow people to toss a few dollars your way.
Also, you might want to have a look at https://www.planetary.social/, which actually builds on a technology developed in Wellington! This is a decentralised social network, i.e. there are no gatekeepers anymore, and one of the core missions of Planetary was to make it easy for people to pay for content they like. Might be too early in its development though.
Thank you Martin! I think Substack for now is the best place to do donations - as I like that I'm giving something in exchange <3 Planetary sounds fascinating though!
I shut down my FB last year and haven't been back. I follow you on Insta (which often seems like a kindER (not kind!) space?) and get your emails/find your stuff on The Spinoff. I agree with some other comments - try it and if it doesn't work, go back to FB but think about how you can make it easier/better for you??
I absolutely support this in principle but what about your event promotion? How will that work without Facebook? You'd be dependent on the venue or promoter to create the listing and raise awareness etc. I know that Facebook dominates the events-listing space these days. (Sigh.)
Very true Bel!
For what it's worth, Emily, I haven't seen one of your fb posts in the longest time. I subscribed to your writing via Spinoff, I think, and get the emails in the inbox. This is clearly an ethical issue and I fully support that. Obviously it's a scary decision because of the threatening sword of financial doom that likes to swing its blade over our heads. What happened when you made your last subscription appeal? Did it have the effect that you wanted? Were you tightening your belt or breaking even? If you had to tighten your belt for a while, what effect would that have on your family? Will the fear of the potential consequences keep you awake or will you sleep better at night having cut ties to a draining and unethical company? I don't understand how the money works with fb or with subscriptions, so I don't feel in any position to tell you what to do, but I'm sure that there are more people out there who would be happy to chip in a bit for content they enjoy - they just need to know it's an option.
Good luck with whatever decision you make :)
Thank you! I basically make no money from FB unless it's indirectly (people following me from there to here or buying tickets to the play). My husband said a similar thing that you did - that cutting ties with a company I think is totally immoral will help me sleep better and feel less stressed. I have really felt the love in this post - it makes me feel like I can do it.
Emily, I understand exactly where you are coming from. I run a small business that is so reliant on social media, and I’m involved in running a number of events that also rely on FB. Having said that, I stopped using my personal FB account 18 months ago, including FB messaging. That was a hard decision because my personal profile was linked quite tightly with my business; but it was absolutely draining and took up too much time and caused too much anxiety, with people ignoring boundaries. I’ll have to decide what to do in terms of my business pages.
Having said that, what is the emotional cost for you to have to deal with the trolls? I can’t see FB stepping up any time soon. And censoring Australian news so that Police, Health, and other pages can’t be seen in the middle of a pandemic is utterly disgusting.
And also what is your audience demographic? I’ve found younger people are moving away from FB. I find a more conservative audience at FB, whereas I found the Spinoff, when I was doing a search on a couple of subjects of interest on Google - and the Spinoff is wonderful and full of writing that gets me thinking.
What Mairi said was spot on - do you need a large audience or the right audience? SEO and keyword search can work very well and I’ve had a couple of mentors point me in the right direction.
Weirdly enough I actually joined Twitter when I had said I never would. I think I joined initially for Sam Neill and Siouxsie Wiles. Siouxsie, being a woman in science, gets a lot of horrible trolling though. I ignore most of the trash on Twitter but I do get great recommendations on writers to follow.
Your writing is wonderful, whatever happens I’m here to stay, and I’ll be telling other people about your writing. Judging by other comments about how readers discovered you it seems that word of mouth works well for you, too.
Thanks so much Kat. I definitely want the right audience, not a big audience. In fact - the 'big' part of it is what I find most overwheming. There's a huge emotional cost to dealing with trolls and I've had six years of it. I just don't think I can cope with it anymore. My hope is that I can move here and folks will follow and share x Thanks for your support x
Oh this is such a hard one! I totally get why you want to drop the mic and ditch them. BUT..... You will reach so few people without FB relatively speaking and and will essentially be preaching to the converted and not changing mindsets and shifting the dial which you do so well and maybe don’t even realise it!
Yeah it's definitely a hard one. I think there's still a way to do that - by other people sharing my content, without me having to be so involved. I never wanted to be someone who argues online with people or changes minds. And I guess I don't think of what I do as preaching (I know that's just a saying but you know what I mean). Most days I just want to share stuff - and it turns into people arguing with me about the most inane stuff and I'm just like, not trying to have a debate! I'm just sharing stuff! So I think of it as saying - after six years, I just don't have the energy for people always wanting to fight me on the most basic stuff.
Fair enough! I confess to forgetting momentarily that you’re are not marketing product, rather, a human being! When I was young I wanted to work in social policy thinking that’s where i could make the biggest change. Then I wanted to be a child or educational psychologist. Then I saw how effective you could be with just a pen (ok, keyboard) and a platform like FB and I think it’s amazing what you have achieved.
Here’s my rudimentary take on things and your role in it: Nathan Wallis sets the scene with the science stuff. Penny Brownlee captures young mummas who know in their gut that their blueprint is off and they need to reboot. You catch us at unexpected moments for years after, keeping things real, reminding us as only you can to stay fierce and kind and parent with empathy and treat children with respect. Whatever you choose I’ll still be there as will the others reading this right now and maybe that’s enough!
Oh that is very, very kind of you!!
I completely understand where you're coming from but I think the problem is that you would get a lot of new subscribers via Facebook. It's probably good publicity. Can you turn off comments on FB posts to avoid trolls (and I guess incentivize people to subscribe so they can comment?
Yeah it would be ideal if I could turn off comments and just direct people here but unfortunately I can't! It's always shitted me because comments get out of control and I spend my life moderating.
BTW I subscribe to The Spinoff but not your page. Do I see less of your work because of that?
If you subscribe to Emily Writes Weekly you will see everything. Paid subscribers get extra content x
OK I have subscribed now :-)
Thank you!
I will support you 100% no matter what you do, but I think you should go for it and leave FB in the dust. I, too, am sick of the dominance that these companies have and how they have tried to infiltrate every area of the way we communicate with one another as human beings - and then hold us to ransom if we try to get rid of them. It ain't right!
I am a paid subscriber and I will gladly pay for your content no matter what. You are an important voice and I appreciate all you do xo
Will follow you to whichever medium you choose!
I really, really like Substack and I really dislike Fb. You follow your heart. I'm with Karen Phillips - Fb is s time sink and there are way better ways for communities to build communications without all the noise on Zuckerberg's wire
Agree. I love Substack! And love it even more since I just recently found out one of the guys who started it is a New Zealander!
Hi Emily I I found you on Facebook and I love your writing.
I hate Zuka as much as the next person but I find myself using Facebook a LOT these days to keep in touch with neighbourly stuff. Now I'm a stay at home mum it's a great lifeline.
What will the alternative be to not using facebook may I ask?
Everyone seems to be switching to Insta. I don't have an Insta account and don't want one. It's all the same evil....
The alternative would be this platform - sending out what I would usually put on FB here. Having chats and discussions here... It's great because you don't get trolls here.
I find Instagram better because if I comment on Facebook then that post pops into the feed of my friends and family but Insta is more... anonymous. That's not quite the right word but I find it's much easier to curate my feed there.
facebook own insta too
I'm torn. It feels like they're trying to get you to quit. If someone tells me I can't do something , my immediate reaction is "oh really, watch me". I would stay just to piss them off. But don't put anything out there that they can profit from... I will always read your writing. The lady couple of years have been extremely difficult for me, and sometimes your articles are the only thing that made me laugh. So no matter your decision, I will continue to try to support you & your hard work!
I hear you x And thank you for all of your support.
Um, what's substack? I found you on the spinoff and follow you via subscription email and have never seen a FB post. I also agree you can write anything from Mars and I'll still read it - you're the best! Keep on being you and good luck working out what to do.
This is Substack - the platform I use to send out the newsletter and what we're having this discussion on. You're so kind x I really appreciate you and everyone else's enormous generosity!
You do you, what's best for you and your whanau - we'll support you no matter what. And really, FB is only good for events etc now anyway I reckon xx
Why not run the experiment? Surely you can always go back if it doesn’t work?I’m in Aus and it’s hard to continue to support the ridiculous Zuckerberg influence-shame was I was in some super cool social justice groups on Facebook that I’d really miss if I gave it up (though we mostly commented on news so maybe we are dissolved already). I’m new to sub-stack, and thought I subscribed ages ago but haven’t checked regular money is coming out of my account so is there a way to find that out? Or maybe I paid a yearly subscription? Sorry, sleep deprived and crap with admin like this. Can you help us newbies with any how to guides! Like others, I will follow you wherever you may go...keep doing you Emily, it’s horrible hearing the impact that those trolls can have on you so any way you can do your thang safer gets my vote. 🙌
Hey Rose - you should be getting weekly emails if you're a paid subscriber? Go to substack.com and check your account details. It could be that the newsletter is going to spam? I can definitely do a how-to guide! Thank you so much x
Sooo worth it-I’m getting the weekly emails-and just checked that I’m all paid up! I congratulate my past self for such excellent judgement. Thanks again for all that you do Emily-it is so appreciated 🙌
Thank you so much for the support!
To be honest, I never knew you had a Facebook page (I now have fomo for having missed out on so much) so it won't personally make much difference to me. I will, however, miss your stories about ridiculous Facebook groups and their absurd members! I am happy to support and follow you through this platform and Instagram - although are you considering deleting that too since it's owned by Facebook? I feel like people are happy to support initiatives that move away from lining the golden pockets of billionaires as long as it doesn't come at the expense of negatively impacting your livelihood? Will support you either way :)
Thank you so much x
Hi Emily, I completely understand why you want to leave Facebook. I will read from wherever you are posting. I would hate to miss out on any of your amazing writing!
Personally I'd go wherever you decide to host your writing. Lots of people are using other platforms, and I subscribe to wherever they go :) Love your writing, and would hate to miss out! <3
Yes. I tend to read writing from people via Patreon. Also considering leaving FB.
I fully support you in this, I'll keep supporting you here, you're worth it ❤
Just subscribed to substack (on a free plan 🙌). I support you too Emily! 🤗
No FB for me if I can avoid it. I subscribe to you specifically to maintain some level of control over what comes my way. Up to you.
Totally agree with your decision to leave FB. I found you on the spinoff and love your emails and don't follow you on FB. Heroines make our world keep spinning!! Kia kaha!
I only read your posts via email. I adore your writing and will read it wherever is the best platform for you. Sending you hugs xxxxxxx
I deactivated FB nearly three weeks ago after using it constantly since 2007 - I thought I'd miss it more than I have, although I'll admit that FOMO has made me check in for a few minutes once a week over that time just to make sure. I feel like an ex-smoker! I haven't decided whether I'll delete my account completely yet, I might just keep doing what I'm doing or pare everything back so that it's just a source for events and business information. I prefer reading your posts via email, and I can satisfy my social media jollies via IG (yeah, I know, owned by FB but I find it a less stressful and more inspiring place to hang out) - that's my 2c worth...
I very rarely look at facebook these days. I mostly use instagram and subscriptions to keep up to date with people. I say do it- especially if it's beneficial for your mental health. I guess you could always go back if it didn't work out?
Quit it. It's a hole. I find Twitter great to inform masses if you need a platform for that.
I like getting your posts by email so wouldn’t feel as if I was “missing out” if you weren’t on Facebook. Do what your conscience says, if it becomes too difficult without it you can always go back (but I really hope it is possible without it!). Zuc is such a bell-end and Scott Morrison a twit
Scott Morrison is such a fucking dick.
absolutely is!! We want Jacinda to make us West NZ and take over from the dumb fuck - he had to get 'Jenny's perspective' (his wifey) on a young staffer raped in Parliament House - WTF?? "Jenny put in into perspective for me - what if it was one of our daughters?' and he is our 'leader',
Follow you on Insta and subscribe to The Spinoff so never look at your page on FB so won't be a loss for me. But understandably a huge leap for you, can you go back to FB if it doesn't work out?
Hi Emily, it's a tough question eh? I run social media for a union, and as you'd imagine Facebook runs contrary to our values. Unfortunately, we have to go where our members are (and Facebook groups are an excellent organising tool), so we are stuck for the moment. At the risk of sounding like an unfeeling robot, perhaps let your metrics make the decision for you? And consider keeping Zuck's face on a nearby dartboard
YES! FB is a nasty nasty hole of misogyny. Have you considered creating an equivalent space in something like Discord (a lot of patreon folks use discord channels to chat with fans). You can control the channels/lists quite well I believe. I stopped using FB over a year ago - the account is still active so i can use Messenger, but i rarely use the main FB anymore.
Substack has a lot of features I don't use. So I think I would just start using them! Thanks so much Lyndon. I definitely agree - I'm so tired of the misogyny there.
I was introduced to you through Gem and Kiki and then read your stuff on Spinoff then subscribed to this. I also follow you on Insta and love that buzz. Facebook can eat shit.
Even though Facebook and Insta are the same thing. I know, it's complicated.
I have never heard of that platform, but Im there! Am signing up in solidarity, support and anticipation!
Thank you! I realised I probably should have just said "my substack newsletter" or just "my newsletter" because that explains it better. Thank you so much for signing up!
I just caught up on the Australia/FB news and I am disgusted. 100% support you getting off of there. I kind of hope these kinds of issues start causing people to jump ship from FB in enough numbers that we all come up with other ways to stay connected. Like you are doing. Good on ya. I will be trying to stay off FB for a while after this. Not for the first time, but it's hard as I use it for several homeschooling/parenting groups.
selfishly, we all want your content, musings and insight.
so you choose the platform, we'll follow.
philosophically, you often take stands. (It's kinda why we like you).
Stand again. x
That's very kind of you! Thank you x
I've got the Gilmore Girls theme song stuck in my head now! I'll add my voice to the chorus: leave Facebook. We will follow. I subscribed to your newsletter the day I read your "parenting is political" piece and realised what was missing from so much of the inane parenting content I read. I don't think it's fair that you or other similar people in the public eye should be copping awful online abuse and trolling - it's like you are paying the price for our "free" content.
Does that mean you'd give IG the flick too? I love your writing, but not via FB, i love your IG stories (watch them daily) and i read your emails sometimes, they are the gold amongst the shit spam in my inbox, when i find see them i read them (note to self; must sort out my spam). Fuck FB.
Thank you! No I like Insta I'll keep it haha - it's good for me because it's locked so I don't have trolls.
Just read your FB post, and here I am 😊
Thank you!
I'll follow your work anywhere! And if it means you don't have to deal with the abuse, more power to you.
Thank you Rumbi!