I am beyond appalled to read this but hardly surprised if that makes sense. Of course it does, we know there is a totally unacceptable but commonplace toxicity that is spreading across the globe. Fuelled by our own so-called government her in Aotearoa - yes that is its name and yes we do speak English but we also have Te Reo Māori and Sign language as our officially recognised languages and we welcome people from other lands and this is not the sole domain of nasty little white privileged males. We also have Te Tiriti o Waitangi and that would be so good to keep remembering as our founding document, not a talking point to do away with at the stroke of a pen. I am so grateful to you Emily for this piece. I have shared it widely and invite all to do the same. Time to stand up, speak out, fight back wahine ma.
What a wonderful piece- what wonderful courageous women you both are. I keep wondering how women can fight back effectively, and identifying the men writing this stuff. Naming them, posting their photos, giving them a location -seems like a step in the right direction. Sarah Templeman in Christchurch showed the way when she tracked down the two Young Nats who had been threatening her, and a film crew showed up at the front door. Confronted them. Two silly little men, making lame explanations. Ours is a small country and knowing who these people are is really useful.
But the next step I think would be to press for threats like this to constitute a serious criminal act, liable for prosecution, and meaningful consequence. Because this is the way women are being forced out of positions of authority in all sorts of areas, and all those years of feminist effort are being destroyed. How can we tell our children that 'Girls can do anything' when we witness Jacinda, driven partly by this abuse into exile? Or Kamala defeated by a man like Trump? This is truly terrible stuff and should be attacked with the full force available to angry women.
Thank you to you both for your words this morning.
When i was 18 in the late 90's I told an older male family member that I thought I was interested in becoming a politician. He told me that may not be a wise idea, as in the 80's Robert Muldoon made Marilyn Waring cry in Parliament, and I was well known for being an emotional woman & an emotion and passioned crier. After he said that, I read Marilyn's book Counting For Nothing: What men value & what women are worth. With my highlighter markings in this book, such as her comparing figures spent on military spending compared to the education budget, you'd think it would have sealed my decision to go into politics. I ended up taking another pathway of interest. However, I ponder in the age of even more strong females in politics - Jacinda Ardern, Julie Anne Denter, and Chlöe Swarbrick (who is even brave enough to be open and transparent about her personal experiences with depression and anxiety) have the courage to stand for Parliament, would have I?!
I'm off to purchase Marilyn's 2019 book, Marilyn Waring: The Political Years, of which Stuff reporter Nikki MacDonald has pulled a Waring quote "Weeping is honest", she says of her tears in Parliament. "Isn't it amazing how threatening it is to be that honest?""
The abuse Julie Anne (and yourself for that matter) experience is so not OK. It should be made illegal! One positive of social media though, is if you have allogarithms working to a favour, eg feminism, it could perhaps inspire and empower more women and men to be active in positive change.
Our current government and social media is feeding these people (men in particular) a narrative that keeps them perpetually angry so they attack women and minorities. But it’s a slight of hand by the government and their wealthy supporters to keep them focused on this and not on realising the real cause of their frustrations - the fight is not between left and right or men v women and other groups. It’s between the rich and the rest of us!
It's time to put our heads together and create a credible counter movement that includes all forms of media. We can't just be on the defensive, reactive but must get ahead of this movement. Bored, scared and lonely people, posting their misdirected anxiety towards the more vulnerable on social media are becoming more emboldened by what they see happening in the US.
It's just devastating to read this. Thank you for speaking out and naming names. Where does this superiority and anger come from, in so many men? Where do we women go to from here?
If AI is as good as they tell us it is, maybe it could be set up to identify and block people who post like this. It's clearly hate speech, they feel powerful because they think they're anonymous.
Or maybe some kind of option to hide comments that do anything a user selects from a list eg that makes derogatory comments based on appearance, is racist, is sexist, etc. Suuuuuuuurely AI can tell.
I got my fb profile on warning once from making two supposedly offensive comments in the space of one month. (One, a line of flipping the bird emojis, and the other, calling someone a twat for being a twat) My profile was on this warning for over a year. If I can get that for that, why not these snowflakes who can't handle seeing an unmade face?
I am not a lawyer but I worked as a prison nurse for 25 years. As I understand it, if you yell at, verbally abuse or talk in a threatening manner to another person it is a technical assault. If you deliver the same information in written form, it is still threatening behaviour.
I can not believe that a) such negative comments are allowed to be printed and broadcast on Face Book and b) I believe those comments should be forwarded to the Police department for some type of action. This is New Zealand and that behaviour is not acceptable.
As with other people who have added comments on this subject, I have been thinking how one might respond proactively to such threatening behaviour.
The following have come to mind; I would like to know how you can communicate with the owners, editors or someone at Face Book to let them know that they are not behaving as a resposible media company.
I may join David Seymors Face Book page and post comments about he content or behaviour I dislike. If hundreds of ordinary Kiwis did this he may begin to realise his behaviour is not acceptable and it would be a different comment for his 'flock' to read.
Perhaps a public tally each week of the hate mail MP's receive. Goodness, why is it that the white male MPs receive very little and the women and ethnic minority MP's have Soooo many!!
As with all PR strategies this would need to be framed in such a way that it did not make the negative experiences of targeted MPs worse.
I would be very happy to be part of any such campaign, other people may have more practical ideas than I can come up with this evening.
I don't say much but I read everything, and want you to know I am so grateful. Thank you for your voice, for fighting, for not staying silent in the face of the bullshit that's going on everywhere. Thank you for focusing on "what can we do".
Gosh this was a really hard read, but, thank you Emily for taking the time to bring it to people's attention and call it out. It really is appalling and so sad that people feel entitled to say these things in a public forum and spread such hate and vitriol.
Awful. These are the same men you always see claiming that being bullied didn't hurt them, that 'you can't say anything these days', that there’s only one way to be a real man.
They all believe they are gangsters, hard men, leaders. No-nonsense, cut-through-the-bullshit crusaders of truth. They think politeness and manners are why nothing gets done.
They believe they are the strongest, yet are somehow also always the victim.
All their jokes are about lazy stereotypes of race, sexual orientation, or gender.
They are rude to waitstaff and anyone they consider lesser for any reason. They love hierarchies, and need to see people struggling below them because they think that proves they are winning. That if they man harder they will advance. They only respect authoritarians.
Once upon a time some were physically imposing, and used that to force respect. Now most are old and fragile, full of anger and regret yet incacapable of reflection, bitter, and impotent.
Their anger at their lot permeates every interaction. They are not capable of happiness, or any emotion that isn’t anger.
They cannot take even the mildest joke.
When kids they loved to bike, now cycleways send them into a frenzy.
Deep down they are all confused, scared shitless of everything, and completely insecure.
None of them know anything how anything works. They take turns ranting at each other at the pub. None of them have actual friends.
And of course, they all loathe women, even their mothers, wives, and daughters.
I feel sorry for any family that have to put up with them.
Scary & gross. Ngā mihi nui to you & Julie Ann - what a great perspective, doing the thing more/harder in response to the vitriol. They're unlikeable & know it - otherwise they'd run for the job, aye? Keep it up J-A, we love your mahi! Hope the kids are feeling much better x
What an important post. You are absolutely right to name these toxic people
I am beyond appalled to read this but hardly surprised if that makes sense. Of course it does, we know there is a totally unacceptable but commonplace toxicity that is spreading across the globe. Fuelled by our own so-called government her in Aotearoa - yes that is its name and yes we do speak English but we also have Te Reo Māori and Sign language as our officially recognised languages and we welcome people from other lands and this is not the sole domain of nasty little white privileged males. We also have Te Tiriti o Waitangi and that would be so good to keep remembering as our founding document, not a talking point to do away with at the stroke of a pen. I am so grateful to you Emily for this piece. I have shared it widely and invite all to do the same. Time to stand up, speak out, fight back wahine ma.
What a wonderful piece- what wonderful courageous women you both are. I keep wondering how women can fight back effectively, and identifying the men writing this stuff. Naming them, posting their photos, giving them a location -seems like a step in the right direction. Sarah Templeman in Christchurch showed the way when she tracked down the two Young Nats who had been threatening her, and a film crew showed up at the front door. Confronted them. Two silly little men, making lame explanations. Ours is a small country and knowing who these people are is really useful.
But the next step I think would be to press for threats like this to constitute a serious criminal act, liable for prosecution, and meaningful consequence. Because this is the way women are being forced out of positions of authority in all sorts of areas, and all those years of feminist effort are being destroyed. How can we tell our children that 'Girls can do anything' when we witness Jacinda, driven partly by this abuse into exile? Or Kamala defeated by a man like Trump? This is truly terrible stuff and should be attacked with the full force available to angry women.
Thank you to you both for your words this morning.
When i was 18 in the late 90's I told an older male family member that I thought I was interested in becoming a politician. He told me that may not be a wise idea, as in the 80's Robert Muldoon made Marilyn Waring cry in Parliament, and I was well known for being an emotional woman & an emotion and passioned crier. After he said that, I read Marilyn's book Counting For Nothing: What men value & what women are worth. With my highlighter markings in this book, such as her comparing figures spent on military spending compared to the education budget, you'd think it would have sealed my decision to go into politics. I ended up taking another pathway of interest. However, I ponder in the age of even more strong females in politics - Jacinda Ardern, Julie Anne Denter, and Chlöe Swarbrick (who is even brave enough to be open and transparent about her personal experiences with depression and anxiety) have the courage to stand for Parliament, would have I?!
I'm off to purchase Marilyn's 2019 book, Marilyn Waring: The Political Years, of which Stuff reporter Nikki MacDonald has pulled a Waring quote "Weeping is honest", she says of her tears in Parliament. "Isn't it amazing how threatening it is to be that honest?""
The abuse Julie Anne (and yourself for that matter) experience is so not OK. It should be made illegal! One positive of social media though, is if you have allogarithms working to a favour, eg feminism, it could perhaps inspire and empower more women and men to be active in positive change.
Our current government and social media is feeding these people (men in particular) a narrative that keeps them perpetually angry so they attack women and minorities. But it’s a slight of hand by the government and their wealthy supporters to keep them focused on this and not on realising the real cause of their frustrations - the fight is not between left and right or men v women and other groups. It’s between the rich and the rest of us!
It's time to put our heads together and create a credible counter movement that includes all forms of media. We can't just be on the defensive, reactive but must get ahead of this movement. Bored, scared and lonely people, posting their misdirected anxiety towards the more vulnerable on social media are becoming more emboldened by what they see happening in the US.
Oooo. What an empowering vision! I like this proactive idea. I'm in!
Julie-Anne is very natural in her approach.
That's a strength of hers and in real life she is popular.
In the city where I live we have an equally clever Mayor, who gets criticised on-line for wearing make-up and dressing well.
Misogynists don't have a preference. They just dislike intelligent women and there are social influencers that fuel that fire.
It's just devastating to read this. Thank you for speaking out and naming names. Where does this superiority and anger come from, in so many men? Where do we women go to from here?
I can’t believe the level of bullshit here 🤦🏻♂️ An innocuous post causes that level of hysteria? Amazing 🤬
If AI is as good as they tell us it is, maybe it could be set up to identify and block people who post like this. It's clearly hate speech, they feel powerful because they think they're anonymous.
Or maybe some kind of option to hide comments that do anything a user selects from a list eg that makes derogatory comments based on appearance, is racist, is sexist, etc. Suuuuuuuurely AI can tell.
I got my fb profile on warning once from making two supposedly offensive comments in the space of one month. (One, a line of flipping the bird emojis, and the other, calling someone a twat for being a twat) My profile was on this warning for over a year. If I can get that for that, why not these snowflakes who can't handle seeing an unmade face?
This is nauseating
Takes courage to show resilience in the face of attacks like these. How can we support people like Julie Ann?!
Kia Kaha Julie-Anne and Emily.
I am not a lawyer but I worked as a prison nurse for 25 years. As I understand it, if you yell at, verbally abuse or talk in a threatening manner to another person it is a technical assault. If you deliver the same information in written form, it is still threatening behaviour.
I can not believe that a) such negative comments are allowed to be printed and broadcast on Face Book and b) I believe those comments should be forwarded to the Police department for some type of action. This is New Zealand and that behaviour is not acceptable.
As with other people who have added comments on this subject, I have been thinking how one might respond proactively to such threatening behaviour.
The following have come to mind; I would like to know how you can communicate with the owners, editors or someone at Face Book to let them know that they are not behaving as a resposible media company.
I may join David Seymors Face Book page and post comments about he content or behaviour I dislike. If hundreds of ordinary Kiwis did this he may begin to realise his behaviour is not acceptable and it would be a different comment for his 'flock' to read.
Perhaps a public tally each week of the hate mail MP's receive. Goodness, why is it that the white male MPs receive very little and the women and ethnic minority MP's have Soooo many!!
As with all PR strategies this would need to be framed in such a way that it did not make the negative experiences of targeted MPs worse.
I would be very happy to be part of any such campaign, other people may have more practical ideas than I can come up with this evening.
Sometimes it does not feel right, to do nothing.
Kia ora Emily.
Ngā mihi maioha Julie Anne.
Thank you for your work.
Thank you for your words.
I don't say much but I read everything, and want you to know I am so grateful. Thank you for your voice, for fighting, for not staying silent in the face of the bullshit that's going on everywhere. Thank you for focusing on "what can we do".
Gosh this was a really hard read, but, thank you Emily for taking the time to bring it to people's attention and call it out. It really is appalling and so sad that people feel entitled to say these things in a public forum and spread such hate and vitriol.
Awful. These are the same men you always see claiming that being bullied didn't hurt them, that 'you can't say anything these days', that there’s only one way to be a real man.
They all believe they are gangsters, hard men, leaders. No-nonsense, cut-through-the-bullshit crusaders of truth. They think politeness and manners are why nothing gets done.
They believe they are the strongest, yet are somehow also always the victim.
All their jokes are about lazy stereotypes of race, sexual orientation, or gender.
They are rude to waitstaff and anyone they consider lesser for any reason. They love hierarchies, and need to see people struggling below them because they think that proves they are winning. That if they man harder they will advance. They only respect authoritarians.
Once upon a time some were physically imposing, and used that to force respect. Now most are old and fragile, full of anger and regret yet incacapable of reflection, bitter, and impotent.
Their anger at their lot permeates every interaction. They are not capable of happiness, or any emotion that isn’t anger.
They cannot take even the mildest joke.
When kids they loved to bike, now cycleways send them into a frenzy.
Deep down they are all confused, scared shitless of everything, and completely insecure.
None of them know anything how anything works. They take turns ranting at each other at the pub. None of them have actual friends.
And of course, they all loathe women, even their mothers, wives, and daughters.
I feel sorry for any family that have to put up with them.
Omg yes! Can I share this on Facebook it’s so so true!!!
Scary & gross. Ngā mihi nui to you & Julie Ann - what a great perspective, doing the thing more/harder in response to the vitriol. They're unlikeable & know it - otherwise they'd run for the job, aye? Keep it up J-A, we love your mahi! Hope the kids are feeling much better x